[PCA] native-plants Digest, Vol 182, Issue 4
John Bridges
jbridgestx at yahoo.com
Sat Feb 14 21:48:43 CST 2015
It is only natural that any excuse to plant yet another non native, invasive plant meet grief here. Here being a native plant list. I would unsubscribe if it didn't.
Not the first time a butterfly enthusiast has tried to get native plant people to plant invasives.
As a whole,
native plant groups have got to be the hardest group for a butterfly enthusiast to give a talk to about attracting butterflies. Unless they are a native plant enthusiast also.
Unlike trying to convince other groups to plant for attracting and feeding butterflies. Native plant people will even plant ugly, thorny plants, just to attract one type of butterfly. Or let insignificant flowering native milkweeds thrive, just to host Monarch babies.
If our natives only feed half as many butterflies as the invasives do? What a beautiful excuse to plant twice as many natives.
I think as native plant people, we respect better than most, that Monarchs are just the poster child for a much wider butterfly problem. Which we address by planting flowering natives that feed a wide range of butterflies and other beneficial insects. All without endangering any other creature's habitat.
We are a extremely easy sell to get us to plant for Monarchs.
Just not at the expense to any of the rest of nature by planting any non native invasive.
John Bridges
Bridges Heritage Growers
Keller, Texas
In the woods & soils of the Cross Timbers
2012 USDA zone 8a
AHS Heat Zone 9
Sunset zone 33
Dallas, Fort Worth area
On Saturday, February 14, 2015 12:00 PM, "native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org" <native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org> wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies
have vanished (Smith, Catherine)
2. Annual Utah rare plant meeting: Mar 10, 2015 in Salt Lake
City (Addsum-Tony Frates)
3. Re: NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies
have vanished (Geyer, Dorothy)
4. Re: NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies
have vanished (Smith, Catherine)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 22:10:40 +0000
From: "Smith, Catherine" <SMITHCATH at ecu.edu>
To: Steve Erickson <wean at whidbey.net>,
"native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org"
<native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org>
Subject: Re: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion
butterflies have vanished
Message-ID:
<2CBD5DC4B3A0954DAE3D153BE4926A58841A12BF at Larry.intra.ecu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
"This person"? "Peddling"? "Lack of consciousness (or knowledge)"? A little arrogant and disrespectful, maybe?
Arguments can be made, pro and con, as to whether the Endangered Species List is a good way to protect the monarch. This list might be a place to discuss policy, if uncommon or unpopular opinions are not personalized as was done here.
Activists for the monarch come in many forms--ordinary citizen, knowledgeable volunteer, agency professional, etc. Action also takes many forms--creating habitats, raising and releasing butterflies, educating, seeking legal remedies, etc. Open minds and varied methods are what we need.
Catherine F. Smith
Spring Mills, PA
________________________________________
From: native-plants [native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] on behalf of Steve Erickson [wean at whidbey.net]
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2015 9:02 PM
To: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
Subject: Re: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
I notice that this person is peddling Buddliea davidii. While
she does include a disclaimer about there being states she
can?t ship to, she does not disclose why (the seriously
invasive nature of this species). This lack of consciousness (or
knowledge?) immediately makes me seriously question her
arguments for why listing per the ESA would be bad for Monarchs.
Note that she ignores that if listed, impacts to Monarchs would
have to be addressed in the pesticide registration and renewal
process. And a lawsuit requiring the same for approval of
pesticide manufacturing GMOs would likely be successful. So, if
the widespread planting of these GMOs is negatively impacting
Monarchs, this will provide a legal mechanism to address that.
-Steve
=========================================
On 2/11/15 at 1:37 PM, SMITHCATH at ecu.edu (Smith, Catherine) wrote:
>Adding to the conversation. . . .
>
>For another perspective, read Rose Franklin's "Plausible
>Negative Consequences of Protecting the Monarch Under the
>Endangered Specieis Act" at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm
>
>For a perspective on planting milkweed, read "Which Milkweed to
>Plant for the Monarchs?" also at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm
>Franklin is author of Fast Track Butterfly Gardening. She
>gardens for butterflies including monarchs in central Pennsylvania.
>
>Catherine F. Smith
>Spring Mills PA
>
>
>________________________________________
>From: native-plants
>[native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] on behalf
>of Kwong, Olivia [okwong at blm.gov]
>Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 9:39 AM
>To: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
>Subject: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion
>butterflies have vanished
>
>http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2015/02/09/the-
>monarch-massacre-nearly-a-billion-butterflies-have-vanished/
>
>The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
>By Darryl Fears
>February 9 at 4:47 PM
>The Washington Post
>
>Threatened animals like elephants, porpoises and lions grab all
>the headlines, but what?s happening to monarch butterflies is
>nothing short of a massacre. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service
>summed it up in just one grim statistic on Monday: Since 1990,
>about 970 million have vanished.
>
>See the link above for the full article text.
>
>_______________________________________________
>native-plants mailing list
>native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
>http://lists.plantconservation.org/mailman/listinfo/native-plants_lists.
>plantconservation.org
>
>Disclaimer
>Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual
>who is posting the message; they are not official opinions or
>positions of the Plant Conservation Alliance.
>
>To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to
>native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org with the word
>"unsubscribe" in the subject line.
------------------------------------------
Whidbey Environmental Action Network
Preservation Education Restoration
Box 53, Langley, WA 98260
(360) 579-4202
wean at whidbey.net
www.whidbeyenvironment.org
==========================================
_______________________________________________
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Disclaimer
Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual who is posting the message; they are not official opinions or positions of the Plant Conservation Alliance.
To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 10:58:17 -0700
From: Addsum-Tony Frates <afrates at addsuminc.com>
To: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
Subject: [PCA] Annual Utah rare plant meeting: Mar 10, 2015 in Salt
Lake City
Message-ID:
<20150213105817.ata8q7pz7ks80o84 at webmail-backup.xmission.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes";
format="flowed"
What: Annual Utah Rare Plant Meeting
Hosts: Red Butte Garden, Garrett Herbarium, and Utah Native Plant Society
When: Tuesday, March 10th 2015
Where: Natural History Museum of Utah, Swaner Forum (5th Floor), 301
Wakara Way, Salt Lake City, Utah (University of Utah campus)
Cost: $15
Posters and presentations are still being accepted.
Entrance fees for presenters will be waived this year.
Registration: http://www.redbuttegarden.org/rare-plant-meeting
By phone: please contact Amie Cox at (801)581-8454 (presenters see below)
Contacts: Jason Alexander (801) 863-6806 alexanja at uvu.edu,
Elizabeth Johnson (801) 587-5745 johnson at nhmu.utah.edu
Catherine Cort (801) 585-5853 catherine.cort at redbutte.utah.edu
Additional link:
http://www.unps.org/PAGES/calendar.html
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 15:18:40 -0500
From: "Geyer, Dorothy" <dorothy_geyer at nps.gov>
To: Steve Erickson <wean at whidbey.net>
Cc: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
Subject: Re: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion
butterflies have vanished
Message-ID:
<CAMegr3DX8ToBgKe1PxPF1g9UzSDgg2Xor+a08NPxnm0MPh-5GA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
She also has very little host and nectar plants that are native, which
according to Doug Tallamy is critical to the health of all butterflies.
Its nice to see that she is selling common milkweed though.
On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 9:02 PM, Steve Erickson <wean at whidbey.net> wrote:
> I notice that this person is peddling Buddliea davidii. While she does
> include a disclaimer about there being states she can?t ship to, she does
> not disclose why (the seriously invasive nature of this species). This lack
> of consciousness (or knowledge?) immediately makes me seriously question
> her arguments for why listing per the ESA would be bad for Monarchs. Note
> that she ignores that if listed, impacts to Monarchs would have to be
> addressed in the pesticide registration and renewal process. And a lawsuit
> requiring the same for approval of pesticide manufacturing GMOs would
> likely be successful. So, if the widespread planting of these GMOs is
> negatively impacting Monarchs, this will provide a legal mechanism to
> address that.
>
> -Steve
>
> =========================================
>
>
> On 2/11/15 at 1:37 PM, SMITHCATH at ecu.edu (Smith, Catherine) wrote:
>
> Adding to the conversation. . . .
>>
>> For another perspective, read Rose Franklin's "Plausible Negative
>> Consequences of Protecting the Monarch Under the Endangered Specieis Act"
>> at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm
>>
>> For a perspective on planting milkweed, read "Which Milkweed to Plant for
>> the Monarchs?" also at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm
>> Franklin is author of Fast Track Butterfly Gardening. She gardens for
>> butterflies including monarchs in central Pennsylvania.
>>
>> Catherine F. Smith
>> Spring Mills PA
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> From: native-plants [native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org]
>> on behalf of Kwong, Olivia [okwong at blm.gov]
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 9:39 AM
>> To: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
>> Subject: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies
>> have vanished
>>
>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2015/02/09/the-
>> monarch-massacre-nearly-a-billion-butterflies-have-vanished/
>>
>> The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
>> By Darryl Fears
>> February 9 at 4:47 PM
>> The Washington Post
>>
>> Threatened animals like elephants, porpoises and lions grab all the
>> headlines, but what?s happening to monarch butterflies is nothing short of
>> a massacre. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service summed it up in just one
>> grim statistic on Monday: Since 1990, about 970 million have vanished.
>>
>> See the link above for the full article text.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> native-plants mailing list
>> native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
>> http://lists.plantconservation.org/mailman/listinfo/native-plants_lists.
>> plantconservation.org
>>
>> Disclaimer
>> Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual who is
>> posting the message; they are not official opinions or positions of the
>> Plant Conservation Alliance.
>>
>> To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to native-plants-request at lists.
>> plantconservation.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
>>
> ------------------------------------------
> Whidbey Environmental Action Network
> Preservation Education Restoration
> Box 53, Langley, WA 98260
> (360) 579-4202
> wean at whidbey.net
> www.whidbeyenvironment.org
> ==========================================
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> native-plants mailing list
> native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
> http://lists.plantconservation.org/mailman/listinfo/native-plants_lists.
> plantconservation.org
>
> Disclaimer
> Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual who is
> posting the message; they are not official opinions or positions of the
> Plant Conservation Alliance.
>
> To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to native-plants-request at lists.
> plantconservation.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
>
--
Dorothy Geyer
Natural Resource Specialist
Colonial National Historical Park
PO Box 210
Yorktown, VA 23690
(757) 898-2433 (O)
(757) 876-7689 (C)
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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 21:24:05 +0000
From: "Smith, Catherine" <SMITHCATH at ecu.edu>
To: "Geyer, Dorothy" <dorothy_geyer at nps.gov>, Steve Erickson
<wean at whidbey.net>
Cc: "native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org"
<native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org>
Subject: Re: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion
butterflies have vanished
Message-ID:
<2CBD5DC4B3A0954DAE3D153BE4926A58841A17E2 at Larry.intra.ecu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Rose Franklin corrects Steve's assumptions (forwarded by Catherine Smith):
"In some areas of the US, buddleia is invasive but, like tropical milkweed, in other areas it isn't invasive at all. We've had butterfly bushes on our property for 20 years and we've only had 10 to 12 volunteers pop up in all those years. Steve should be alerted to the fact that there are now buddleias on the market that are sterile (likely produced by plant breeders who knew there would be a request for them in the near future). He wrote 'while she does include a disclaimer about there being states she can't ship to, she does not disclose why (the seriously invasive nature of this species).' In reality, it is the Japanese beetle quarantine that restricts me from shipping to more states than I do. It is not illegal to ship buddleia to the states I don't ship them to...or, if it is illegal to ship buddleia to some states, no one from the USDA has told me."
Thanks to all for this informative conversation.
CS
________________________________________
From: native-plants [native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] on behalf of Geyer, Dorothy [dorothy_geyer at nps.gov]
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 3:18 PM
To: Steve Erickson
Cc: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org
Subject: Re: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
She also has very little host and nectar plants that are native, which according to Doug Tallamy is critical to the health of all butterflies. Its nice to see that she is selling common milkweed though.
On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 9:02 PM, Steve Erickson <wean at whidbey.net<mailto:wean at whidbey.net>> wrote:
I notice that this person is peddling Buddliea davidii. While she does include a disclaimer about there being states she can?t ship to, she does not disclose why (the seriously invasive nature of this species). This lack of consciousness (or knowledge?) immediately makes me seriously question her arguments for why listing per the ESA would be bad for Monarchs. Note that she ignores that if listed, impacts to Monarchs would have to be addressed in the pesticide registration and renewal process. And a lawsuit requiring the same for approval of pesticide manufacturing GMOs would likely be successful. So, if the widespread planting of these GMOs is negatively impacting Monarchs, this will provide a legal mechanism to address that.
-Steve
=========================================
On 2/11/15 at 1:37 PM, SMITHCATH at ecu.edu<mailto:SMITHCATH at ecu.edu> (Smith, Catherine) wrote:
Adding to the conversation. . . .
For another perspective, read Rose Franklin's "Plausible Negative Consequences of Protecting the Monarch Under the Endangered Specieis Act" at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm<http://www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm>
For a perspective on planting milkweed, read "Which Milkweed to Plant for the Monarchs?" also at www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm<http://www.butterflybushes.com/press_room.htm>
Franklin is author of Fast Track Butterfly Gardening. She gardens for butterflies including monarchs in central Pennsylvania.
Catherine F. Smith
Spring Mills PA
________________________________________
From: native-plants [native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org>] on behalf of Kwong, Olivia [okwong at blm.gov<mailto:okwong at blm.gov>]
Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 9:39 AM
To: native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org>
Subject: [PCA] NEWS: The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2015/02/09/the-
monarch-massacre-nearly-a-billion-butterflies-have-vanished/
The monarch massacre: Nearly a billion butterflies have vanished
By Darryl Fears
February 9 at 4:47 PM
The Washington Post
Threatened animals like elephants, porpoises and lions grab all the headlines, but what?s happening to monarch butterflies is nothing short of a massacre. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service summed it up in just one grim statistic on Monday: Since 1990, about 970 million have vanished.
See the link above for the full article text.
_______________________________________________
native-plants mailing list
native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org>
http://lists.plantconservation.org/mailman/listinfo/native-plants_lists.
plantconservation.org<http://plantconservation.org>
Disclaimer
Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual who is posting the message; they are not official opinions or positions of the Plant Conservation Alliance.
To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org> with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
------------------------------------------
Whidbey Environmental Action Network
Preservation Education Restoration
Box 53, Langley, WA 98260
(360) 579-4202
wean at whidbey.net<mailto:wean at whidbey.net>
www.whidbeyenvironment.org<http://www.whidbeyenvironment.org>
==========================================
_______________________________________________
native-plants mailing list
native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants at lists.plantconservation.org>
http://lists.plantconservation.org/mailman/listinfo/native-plants_lists.plantconservation.org
Disclaimer
Posts on this list reflect only the opinion of the individual who is posting the message; they are not official opinions or positions of the Plant Conservation Alliance.
To unsubscribe, send an e-mail to native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:native-plants-request at lists.plantconservation.org> with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject line.
--
Dorothy Geyer
Natural Resource Specialist
Colonial National Historical Park
PO Box 210
Yorktown, VA 23690
(757) 898-2433 (O)
(757) 876-7689 (C)
[http://www.nps.gov/subjects/centennial/images/NPS-Centennial-E-Mail-Signature-11-24-14.jpg]
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------------------------------
End of native-plants Digest, Vol 182, Issue 4
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