[APWG] Plants Aliens Uses Re: A place for Aliens--steaming in my compost pile

[Wayne Tyson]

APWG:

"Shouldn't we stop intentionally sowing those ecosystem-killing weeds onto our highways and public lands?" Craig Dremmann

Yes, "we" should stop that practice--and we might do well to stop constructing straw-men rather than directly addressing the points made in referenced papers and initial posts that propose only that discussion of the real issues raised in them take place rather than vague innuendo. 

I hope that I do not err when I presume that the purpose of this list is to provide a forum for the exchange of facts, data, and ideas rather than decay into firing squad against firing squad, as it were . . . I hope that instead that APWG subscribers will elect to shed more light and less heat upon the pros and cons of all issues raised here. 

I offer this quote from the paper initially submitted for discussion and a link to the paper (which, to obtain enough information for relevant comment should be read in its entirety); still, the quote is the opening paragraph, which, to me, seems inconsistent with Dremmann's closing assertion and misleading with respect (no pun intended) to the content of the paper under discussion: 
"Most ecologists and engaged environmentalists justifiably regard invasive, non-native species as a leading threat to conservation values. In the US, for example, they are reportedly the second greatest threat to native species, outranked only by habitat loss (Wilcove et al. 1998). Increasingly large, though still inadequate, financial resources are being brought to bear in the campaign against alien species. Many conservationists feel that to achieve success resources should be focused on prevention, eradication, control, and containment." 
http://www.globalrestorationnetwork.org/uploads/files/LiteratureAttachments/20_a-place-for-alien-species-in-ecosystem-restoration.pdf

WT

PS: While it should make no difference at all to this discussion, I do not necessarily agree with every point made in the paper; that is never a requirement of mine in considering a work worthy of intellectual enquiry. I am interested in all discussion, particularly when it is well-reasoned, both in support and refutation. 

NOTE: Is it considered good form to completely trim the original subject line when replying to a post? I would prefer, if a contributor wishes to add a subheading, that the original be retained, preferably following the original, but when clarity is better served, retaining it following the new thread (only when an entirely new thread, but still related in some way to the original post, is logically indicated). I hope that we can all help us all achieve a better and better listserv community by improving such protocols when common sense and mutual consideration indicate that improvement is possible. 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Craig Dremann - Redwood City Seed Company" <Craig at astreet.com>
To: <apwg at lists.plantconservation.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2011 8:55 AM
Subject: [APWG] A place for Aliens--steaming in my compost pile


> Dear All,
> 
> The article -- A place for alien species in ecosystem
> restoration -- is written from a Hawaiian US Forest Service perspective,
> where those islands are probably as exotic-infested as we are here in
> California, and it will take hundreds of millions of dollars to start the
> conversion back to a 100% native Hawaiian understory.
> 
> When none of the US government agencies, including the ones with the
> biggest budgets like the Federal Highway admin. or the military, provide
> any signicant annual per-acre budgets to manage exotic plants on our
> Federal lands, then perhaps you are going to write articles trying to put
> a positive spin on exotics, if your agency is never going to get any funds
> from Congress to do the right thing.
> 
> And at the same time, if Congress is still spending millions of dollars
> annually  to purchase millions of pounds of exotic seeds, to be sown onto
> our Federal lands, like smooth brome, crested wheatgrass, exotic clovers,
> etc., and also along Federal highways, everyone on the List-server should
> expect to see many articles in the future that promote exotic invasive
> plant use, to justify that ecosystem destruction?
> 
> The Place for Aliens article can be downloaded for free from Google
> Scholar as a PDF file, and is 7 pages, at
> http://www.globalrestorationnetwork.org/uploads/files/LiteratureAttachments/20_a-place-for-alien-species-in-ecosystem-restoration.pdf
> 
> Yes, I agree that there is a place for alien species--nicely composing
> away at a very high temperature to kill its seeds in my compost pile, to
> feed the native plants in the area, once the composting process is
> completed.
> 
> By the way, my test plots on exotic annual grasses in Palo Alto, CA. hills
> are producing some very interesting and unexpected result in terms of
> their nutrient take-up--drawing down the soil nutrient levels to near
> zero, and far below where native seedlings can survive.
> 
> The exotics working with the cows and sheep over time, especially in the
> arid West, can draw down the soil nutrients within a few years, below the
> threshold where native seedlings can survive, like what I show at
> http://www.ecoseeds.com/good.example.html.  When the native seedlings do
> not have the necessary levels of nutrients, the seeds germinate and die.
> 
> Allelopathy produced by the exotics killing our natives, and the ability
> of the weeds to mine and rob soil nutrients from the native seedlings, may
> be the two strongest cases against allowing ANY exotics within our native
> ecosyetems on public lands, and along our highways?
> 
> Shouldn't we stop intentionally sowing those ecosystem-killing weeds onto
> our highways and public lands?
> 
> Sincerely,  Craig Dremann (650) 325-7333
> 
> 
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> 
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> Any requests, advice or opinions posted to this list reflect ONLY the opinion of the individual posting the message.
> 
> 
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