[MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng

Wed Sep 11 17:10:16 CDT 2013

Liz,
I am a horticulturist, so not qualified to address this medical angle on
this. I suggest in addition to Dr. Wolkow, that you talk with Mark
Blumenthal at  the American Botanical Council in Texas. I believe they
published an article on ginseng efficacy in their journal a few years back,
I just don't have time to track it down now.

Jeanine

Jeanine M. Davis, Ph.D. 
Associate Professor and Extension Specialist 
Dept. of Horticultural Science, NC State University 
Email: Jeanine_Davis at ncsu.edu 
Websites:  http://ncherb.org  http://ncspecialtycrops.org
http://ncorganic.org 
Blog:  http://ncalternativecropsandorganics.blogspot.com 
Twitter: http://twitter.com/JeanineNCSU 
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/people/Jeanine-Davis/1442912228 
Address: Mtn. Hort. Crops Research & Extension Center 
455 Research Drive, Mills River, NC 28759 
Phone:  828-684-3562   FAX:  828-684-8715 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: MPWG [mailto:mpwg-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] On Behalf
> Of Wendy Applequist
> Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 5:47 PM
> To: Wolkow, Robert; Elizabeth.Blaker at nau.edu
> Cc: mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org
> Subject: Re: [MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng
> 
> Dr. Wolkow,
> 
> Since placebo-controlled clinical trials of ginseng report benefits
including
> normalization of blood sugar levels, improvement of fatigue associated
with
> certain conditions, and reduction of the incidence and duration of common
> colds, I think that this statement is too broad to be justified by the
evidence.
> 
> Wendy Applequist
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: MPWG [mailto:mpwg-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] On Behalf
> Of Wolkow, Robert
> Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 3:51 PM
> To: shsa at sasktel.net; herbalogic at yahoo.com; Elizabeth.Blaker at nau.edu
> Cc: mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org; schenkmj at earthlink.net
> Subject: Re: [MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng
> 
> Liz,
> 
> As a physician I would be happy to talk with you as the medical evidence
that
> ginseng is beneficial indicates it is no better then placebo and so not
robust
> enough to be a valid treatment. So I am not sure why it is being grown
other
> then to make money or perhaps protect our biodiversity which I see as the
> only worthy reason scientifically/medically.
> 
> Rob Wolkow MD M.Phil. FAAFP
> 
> 
> 
> Scent from my Droid Smartfon wit glow bull voice wreck ignition soft
Where?
> 
> Peas 4 give n e spelling or gramatickle miss steaks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ;::,,
> 
> 
> o
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Elizabeth Ann Blaker [Elizabeth.Blaker at nau.edu]
> Received: Wednesday, 11 Sep 2013, 4:01pm
> To: Connie Kehler [shsa at sasktel.net]; herbalogic at yahoo.com
> [herbalogic at yahoo.com]
> CC: mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org [mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org];
> Michael Schenk [schenkmj at earthlink.net]
> Subject: Re: [MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng
> 
> Hello all,
> I am a science/nature writer and have been following this thread with
> interest. I am thinking about writing an article about the real issues
with
> ginseng conservation, setting the record straight.
> 
> Several of you have written very interesting posts on this topic, and I
hope
> you won't mind if I contact you individually by e-mail to ask some
questions. I
> find it both sad and interesting that government policies meant to protect
> ginseng are seemingly having the opposite effect - I would like to talk to
> anyone who is conducting studies on this.
> 
> I would like to talk to people from as wide a range of perspectives as
> possible, including researchers, conservationists, herbalists, harvesters,
> wholesalers, and even those who poach.
> 
> Please send me e-mail if you would like to talk with me.
> 
> My background is in both science and writing -- I have a master's degree
in
> Biology and have written articles for magazines, public radio, websites,
and
> various university projects.
> 
> Thanks,
> Liz Blaker
> ________________________________
> From: MPWG [mpwg-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org] on behalf of
> Connie Kehler [shsa at sasktel.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 12:41 PM
> To: herbalogic at yahoo.com
> Cc: mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org; Michael Schenk
> Subject: Re: [MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng
> 
> Very very well put!!!
> 
> 
> 
> CHECK US OUT AT www.saskherbspice.org<http://www.saskherbspice.org>
> 
> On 2013-09-11, at 1:33 PM,
> herbalogic at yahoo.com<mailto:herbalogic at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> Bravo Bob!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 8, 2013, at 7:45 AM, Robert Layton Beyfuss
> <rlb14 at cornell.edu<mailto:rlb14 at cornell.edu>> wrote:
> 
> 
> Here is he letter as it was sent out yesterday. My thanks to my friend
Scott
> Persons for editing!
> Dear CBS News,
> I was troubled to read and watch the segment you aired the morning of
> September 5th regarding North Carolina wild ginseng. It contains factual
> errors and shows a bias towards sensationalism that is disappointing.
> Your choice to interview only one dealer, Mr. Eidus, was a poor one, since
he
> does not represent the majority of ginseng dealers. Indeed, his opinion --
> that 90% of the wild ginseng he purchases has been poached - is certainly
not
> shared by the majority of other ginseng dealers. His willingness to
purchase it
> nevertheless is a bad example, which reflects poorly on the industry in
> general. His opinion that ginseng will be gone in 10 to 20 years is pure
> nonsense, as a simple "fact check" with state or federal regulatory
officials
> would have easily revealed. Is it the policy of CBS news to quote
> unsubstantiated sources when legitimate sources of information are readily
> available?
> What is even more troubling is your lending credence to the proposition
that
> the major threat to ginseng is posed by poachers.
> This erroneous assumption is so often repeated by the media that it is now
> widely accepted as fact, but a recent article published in "Science"
> magazine by the leading Ginseng Conservation Biologist Professor, James
> McGraw of West Virginia University, states that predation by white tailed
> deer is the most serious threat to the species and not poachers.
> Most individuals who harvest wild ginseng also replant seeds, thereby
> expanding existing populations, often relocating them to areas that are
more
> secure from deer or development. I can understand your ignorance
> regarding the population dynamics of a wild plant, but published data by
> Professor McGraw, as well as other legitimate researchers, suggests that
> stewardship of wild populations by harvesters can significantly increase
> populations, Ironically, even poachers, such as Mr. Hurley, sometimes aid
in
> the preservation and perpetuation of the species (although those who hunt
> out of season, take every plant they find, and fail to plant the berries
> certainly do not).
> 
> Finally, Charlie Rose's, comment wondering why it is not widely grown, is
a
> thoughtful and legitimate query. Unfortunately, cultivated ginseng is not
> worth very much and suitable habitat for growing "wild simulated"
> ginseng is rare and increasingly threatened by development. Ginseng
> populations may recover from poaching events, but they will never recover
> from being paved. The fact is that most so called "wild" ginseng is
"grown" by
> people who return to the same areas regularly to pick berries and replant
> seed as they harvest mature roots.
> Ms. Leopold's comments regarding the lack of interest in conservation are
> accurate in the sense that it is more "newsworthy" to report the misdeeds
of
> a few individuals, while ignoring the real issues that should be
addressed.
> I am saddened that CBS did such a poor job in reporting this story.
> Sincerely,
> Bob Beyfuss
> Retired American Ginseng Specialist for Cornell University Cooperative
> Extension.
> Licensed NY State Ginseng Dealer
> Rlb14 at cornell.edu<mailto:Rlb14 at cornell.edu>
> 
> 136 Schuessler Lane, Preston Hollow NY 12469
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: MPWG
> [mpwg-bounces at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:mpwg-
> bounces at lists.plan
> tconservation.org>] on behalf of Michael Schenk
> [schenkmj at earthlink.net<mailto:schenkmj at earthlink.net>]
> Sent: Saturday, September 07, 2013 9:19 PM
> To:
> mpwg at lists.plantconservation.org<mailto:mpwg at lists.plantconservation.or
> g
> >
> Subject: Re: [MPWG] MPWG V1#1 -- ginseng
> 
> While we might argue about details and dates of extinction (hey, what do
> you expect from tv?), wild ginseng is definitely heavily threatened, by a
> synergy of factors.
> 
> "Poaching". There are gray areas here, where traditional harvesting might
> cross a paper border, but there are clear signs that the nature of ginseng
> harvesting has changed. Here's one anecdote: a friend who grew up digging
> sang found a good bed. He harvested from that bed for years, but made the
> mistake of disclosing it to an in-law with drug issues. The entire bed
> disappeared. Combine this anecdote with the ongoing recession and the
> spread of meth and painkiller addiction... So traditional diggers are also
> stewards, but there's another, newer ethos going on here.
> 
> Habitat loss. Population's increasing, and an awful lot of people of means
> want a lawn in the country. Mountaintop removal coal mining buries
> Appalachian coves in waste; prime ginseng habitat is used as a landfill.
> Interstate highways just have to be built. I'm sure MPWGers can fill in
many
> other habitat issues.
> 
> Invasive species. I know we've argued this over in the past, but I've seen
> with my own eyes how stiltgrass and tearthumb can completely dominate
> forest edge areas, as well as interior areas. With habitat fragmentation,
> there's lots more edge, too.
> 
> Climate change. Another hot button, but it's happening. Plants are
especially
> vulnerable to rapidly changing ecosystems, especially slow-growing plants
> with modest seed dispersal. Ginseng likes it cool.
> I've seen it grow best near the foot of a ridge, flushed with rain runoff.
As
> the coves and hollows warm, the cooler zone moves higher towards the
> peak, plus it gets drier. Eventually, we run out of mountain. Animals and
birds
> can migrate to the next ridge over, but how many of those will be passing
> ginseng seed?
> 
> Deer. Many populations are out of whack. "Browse lines" are familiar to
> many or most of us, where there's nothing but thick woody stems below
> reaching height for a hungry deer. Not only forest-floor plants, but
future
> generations of trees, are disappearing there.
> 
> These factors make it critical to have protected areas for wild ginseng.
> Cultivated ginseng isn't the same. Commercial seed sources can be
> chemically dependent on pesticides after generations of cultivation. I
grow
> wild simulated, but this is indeed simulated, not a distinctive population
> adapted to a locale over thousands of years (even if wild simulated does
sell
> as "wild"). Ginseng has been shown to develop many isolated, genetically
> distinct populations. Each time we lose a bed, we could be losing the
> equivalent of an entire subspecies.
> 
> These problems are beyond the scope of any single or easy solution, but we
> definitely need to protect as many wild populations as we can. Even from a
> commercial viewpoint, this makes sense, to maintain genetic diversity as
> insurance against blight and inbreeding. Traditional diggers who replant
> probably do more than anyone in this regard. The government is limited in
> what steps it can take, but it does have statutory responsibility in
National
> Parks, as well as responsibility for the trade of endangered species per
CITES.
> I've also heard horror stories from private landowner/growers who have had
> years of work dug up in a day, with very limited legal recourse. Maybe we
> could use more rights for small growers.
> 
> What do folks think about instituting isolated, single-population ginseng
> growing refuges, clearly identified as to source and lineage?
> (similar to the seed bank Marla proposes on
> change.org<http://change.org>) This would be an active step beyond the
> necessary but somewhat passive protection of wild populations. I tend to
> buy seed from a single grower, but I have mixed some seed from another
> source.
> 
> Bob, for some reason I didn't see your letter in your post, the attachment
> may not have survived the digest format.
> 
> Mike Schenk
> 
> PS: Let's not point fingers about the video, after all this is "television
> journalism" - low info content, short attention span, high drama. 'Nuff
said
> <grin>.
> 
> >
> >Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. ginseng in the news (Susan Leopold) 2. Re: ginseng in the news
> > (Colin Donohue) 3. Re: ginseng in the news (Michael McGuffin)
> >
> >
> >----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Message: 1
> >Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 17:15:39 -0400
> >From: Susan Leopold
> >To: mpwg
> >Subject: [MPWG] ginseng in the news
> >Message-ID:
> >
> ><5DE76C5A-A955-4B6D-BCC9-
> A93B83BEB7CB at unitedplantsavers.org<mailto:5DE7
> >6C5A-A955-4B6D-BCC9-A93B83BEB7CB at unitedplantsavers.org>>
> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >
> >United Plant Savers has started a change.org<http://change.org> letter
> to bring awareness to our members and the public and to show various
> agencies that the public cares and supports ginseng conservation
efforts....
> >
> >Below is a link to the CBS story and to our
> change.org<http://change.org> letter, also you can go to the UpS website
> www.unitedplantsavers.org<http://www.unitedplantsavers.org> for links to
> several recent news articles and ginseng recently published research.
> >
> >Please join this campaign: http://chn.ge/15Eon5H
> >
> >
> >
> >http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505269_162-57601454/ginseng-poaching-
> threat
> >ens-survival-of-plant-species/
> >
> >Susan Leopold, PhD
> >Executive Director, UpS
> >703-667-0208
> >susan at unitedplantsavers.org<mailto:susan at unitedplantsavers.org>
> >
> 
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> reflects ONLY the opinion of the individual who posts the message. The
> information contained in posts is not intended nor implied to be a
substitute
> for professional medical advice relative to your specific medical
condition or
> question. All medical and other healthcare information that is discussed
on
> this list should be carefully reviewed by the individual reader and their
> qualified healthcare professional.
> Posts do not reflect any official opinions or positions of the Plant
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> 
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> Disclaimer
> Any advice given on this list regarding diagnosis or treatments etc.
> reflects ONLY the opinion of the individual who posts the message. The
> information contained in posts is not intended nor implied to be a
substitute
> for professional medical advice relative to your specific medical
condition or
> question. All medical and other healthcare information that is discussed
on
> this list should be carefully reviewed by the individual reader and their
> qualified healthcare professional.
> Posts do not reflect any official opinions or positions of the Plant
> Conservation Alliance.
> 
> 
> 
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> Disclaimer
> Any advice given on this list regarding diagnosis or treatments etc.
reflects
> ONLY the opinion of the individual who posts the message. The information
> contained in posts is not intended nor implied to be a substitute for
> professional medical advice relative to your specific medical condition or
> question. All medical and other healthcare information that is discussed
on
> this list should be carefully reviewed by the individual reader and their
> qualified healthcare professional. Posts do not reflect any official
opinions or
> positions of the Plant Conservation Alliance.